docbook-apps

  • 1.  Re: [docbook-apps] Converting Docbook epub to Kindle shows warnings

    Posted 03-20-2020 04:16
    This is very interesting to me. I have tried for two projects to generate
    indexes that would work on Kindle. The indexterm content had both a primary
    and secondary level. Everything would look good in epubs on epub reading
    systems(and be valid, etc), but in mobipocket it would render
    inconsistently the elements in the index -- sometimes indenting, sometimes
    putting them on the same line. It was a mess. Even though it rendered fine
    in Kindle Previewer on all simulated devices, the dl, dt, dd just scrambled
    everything on Kindle app for android as well as on e-ink Paperwhites.

    I spent a lot of time trying to troubleshoot (and the details were fuzzy),
    but concluded that the problem lay not with docbook but with kindlegen (or
    maybe the css support on kindle reading systems). It's frustrating because
    having a good multilevel index is standard on many nonfiction ebooks.

    On the other hand, when looking at Bob's POWER SHIFT ebook (which came out
    a few years ago), the index rendered fine on Kindle. - although in that
    ebook, it used page numbers for an ebook.

    (In my projects, I used <xsl:param name="index.prefer.titleabbrev"
    select="1"></xsl:param> and <xsl:param name="index.links.to.section"
    select="0"></xsl:param> )
    (I could provide an ebook example if you need)

    BTW, never got around to saying it, but Bob I enjoyed Power Shift ebook

    Robert Nagle






    From: Richard Hamilton <hamilton@xmlpress.net>
    To: Lars Vogel <lars.vogel@gmail.com>
    Cc: Jason Zech <zech@loyolapress.com>, DocBook Apps <
    docbook-apps@lists.oasis-open.org>
    Bcc:
    Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 18:42:50 -0700
    Subject: Re: [docbook-apps] Converting Docbook epub to Kindle shows warnings
    Hi Lars,

    I know this is from a long time ago, but I just ran into the same problem
    with a file that nests variable lists using the list-presentation=“blocks”
    processing instruction.

    In that case, the XHTML5 (this is with 1.79.2, building an epub3) is valid,
    but kindlegen doesn’t like the nesting. It closes off the highest level
    and
    elements and flags some
    elements as being invalid.

    The result doesn’t lose any content, but it removes the nesting and
    flattens everything to one level.

    As with your case, the epub is valid and when displayed, the nesting is
    fine.

    At this point, I’m convinced that the problem is in kindlegen. I just used
    the Kindle previewer, which wasn’t available in 2012, and it created a
    .mobi file that preserves the nesting (at least on the devices I tried in
    the previewer).

    Anyway, this is probably way to late to help, but I figured I’d add it to
    the thread in case someone runs into it in the future, since it is still a
    problem using kindlegen.

    Best regards,
    Dick Hamilton
    -------
    XML Press
    XML for Technical Communicators
    http://xmlpress.net
    hamilton@xmlpress.net

    --
    Robert Nagle
    5115 Sandyfields Ln Katy, TX 77494
    (Cell) 832-251-7522



  • 2.  Re: [docbook-apps] Converting Docbook epub to Kindle shows warnings

    Posted 03-20-2020 16:13
    The index in my /Power Shift/ ebook does not use dl, dt, and dd in the
    epub xhtml.  I gave up on them and rewrote autoidx.xsl to output div
    elements instead, with CSS to supply the indents.  In a nutshell:

    became


    became


    became


    That's it.  Since the divs are already nested by the indexing templates,
    it turns out that the only CSS I needed was:

    div.dd {
      margin-left: 2em;
    }

    I had intended to fold this back into the next release, so thanks for
    reminding me about this.

    By the way, if you liked /Power Shift/, you should check out my new book
    /Solar Dividends/ which describes how to use solar energy to eliminate
    poverty in the world.

    Bob Stayton
    bobs@sagehill.net

    On 3/19/2020 9:16 PM, Robert Nagle wrote:
    > This is very interesting to me.  I have tried for two projects to
    > generate indexes that would work on Kindle. The indexterm content had
    > both a primary and secondary level. Everything would look good in
    > epubs on epub reading systems(and be valid, etc), but in mobipocket it
    > would render inconsistently the elements in the index -- sometimes
    > indenting, sometimes putting them on the same line. It was a mess.
    > Even though it rendered fine in Kindle Previewer on all simulated
    > devices, the dl, dt, dd just scrambled everything on Kindle app for
    > android as well as on e-ink Paperwhites.
    >
    > I spent a  lot of time trying to troubleshoot (and the details were
    > fuzzy), but concluded that the problem lay not with docbook but with
    > kindlegen (or maybe the css support on kindle reading systems). It's
    > frustrating because having a good multilevel index is standard on many
    > nonfiction ebooks.
    >
    > On the other hand, when looking at Bob's POWER SHIFT ebook (which came
    > out a few years ago), the index rendered fine on Kindle. - although in
    > that ebook, it used page numbers for an ebook.
    >
    > (In my projects, I used   <xsl:param name="index.prefer.titleabbrev"
    > select="1"></xsl:param> and   <xsl:param name="index.links.to.section"
    > select="0"></xsl:param> )
    > (I could provide an ebook example if you need)
    >
    > BTW, never got around to saying it, but Bob I enjoyed Power Shift ebook
    >
    > Robert Nagle
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > From: Richard Hamilton <hamilton@xmlpress.net
    > <mailto:hamilton@xmlpress.net>>
    > To: Lars Vogel <lars.vogel@gmail.com <mailto:lars.vogel@gmail.com>>
    > Cc: Jason Zech <zech@loyolapress.com <mailto:zech@loyolapress.com>>,
    > DocBook Apps <docbook-apps@lists.oasis-open.org
    > <mailto:docbook-apps@lists.oasis-open.org>>
    > Bcc:
    > Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 18:42:50 -0700
    > Subject: Re: [docbook-apps] Converting Docbook epub to Kindle shows
    > warnings
    > Hi Lars,
    >
    > I know this is from a long time ago, but I just ran into the same
    > problem with a file that nests variable lists using the
    > list-presentation=“blocks” processing instruction.
    >
    > In that case, the XHTML5 (this is with 1.79.2, building an epub3) is
    > valid, but kindlegen doesn’t like the nesting. It closes off the
    > highest level
    and
    elements and flags some
    elements as
    > being invalid.
    >
    > The result doesn’t lose any content, but it removes the nesting and
    > flattens everything to one level.
    >
    > As with your case, the epub is valid and when displayed, the nesting
    > is fine.
    >
    > At this point, I’m convinced that the problem is in kindlegen. I just
    > used the Kindle previewer, which wasn’t available in 2012, and it
    > created a .mobi file that preserves the nesting (at least on the
    > devices I tried in the previewer).
    >
    > Anyway, this is probably way to late to help, but I figured I’d add it
    > to the thread in case someone runs into it in the future, since it is
    > still a problem using kindlegen.
    >
    > Best regards,
    > Dick Hamilton
    > -------
    > XML Press
    > XML for Technical Communicators
    > http://xmlpress.net <http://xmlpress.net/>
    > hamilton@xmlpress.net <mailto:hamilton@xmlpress.net>
    >
    > --
    > Robert Nagle
    > 5115 Sandyfields Ln Katy, TX 77494
    > (Cell) 832-251-7522



  • 3.  Re: [docbook-apps] Converting Docbook epub to Kindle shows warnings

    Posted 03-21-2020 00:06
    Hi Bob and Robert,

    Things get curiouser and curiouser:-). It looks like kindlegen does pretty much the same conversion as the previewer.

    When I use the kindle app on my Macbook, the variable lists (i.e., dl lists) do not nest, but when I run the same file on the previewer, of in the app on my iphone, it works fine.

    So, the problem may be viewer specific. The only difference is that kindlegen complains about this and provides false notes about closing off tags, while the previewer is silent.

    Bob, can you post or send me your modification of autoidx.xsl? I’d like to try it out, and I’m glad to be a tester. And does this index generate page number

    Best regards,
    Dick

    P.S. I’m going to get Solar Dividends, too. The topic is interesting, and I’d like to see the results of that autoidx.xsl. Thanks for making it available as a free ebook.
    -------
    XML Press
    XML for Technical Communicators
    http://xmlpress.net
    hamilton@xmlpress.net



    > On Mar 20, 2020, at 09:13, Bob Stayton <bobs@sagehill.net> wrote:
    >
    > The index in my Power Shift ebook does not use dl, dt, and dd in the epub xhtml. I gave up on them and rewrote autoidx.xsl to output div elements instead, with CSS to supply the indents. In a nutshell:
    >
    >
    became

    >
    >
    became

    >
    >
    became

    >
    > That's it. Since the divs are already nested by the indexing templates, it turns out that the only CSS I needed was:
    >
    > div.dd {
    > margin-left: 2em;
    > }
    >
    > I had intended to fold this back into the next release, so thanks for reminding me about this.
    >
    > By the way, if you liked Power Shift, you should check out my new book Solar Dividends which describes how to use solar energy to eliminate poverty in the world.
    > Bob Stayton
    >
    > bobs@sagehill.net
    > On 3/19/2020 9:16 PM, Robert Nagle wrote:
    >> This is very interesting to me. I have tried for two projects to generate indexes that would work on Kindle. The indexterm content had both a primary and secondary level. Everything would look good in epubs on epub reading systems(and be valid, etc), but in mobipocket it would render inconsistently the elements in the index -- sometimes indenting, sometimes putting them on the same line. It was a mess. Even though it rendered fine in Kindle Previewer on all simulated devices, the dl, dt, dd just scrambled everything on Kindle app for android as well as on e-ink Paperwhites.
    >>
    >> I spent a lot of time trying to troubleshoot (and the details were fuzzy), but concluded that the problem lay not with docbook but with kindlegen (or maybe the css support on kindle reading systems). It's frustrating because having a good multilevel index is standard on many nonfiction ebooks.
    >>
    >> On the other hand, when looking at Bob's POWER SHIFT ebook (which came out a few years ago), the index rendered fine on Kindle. - although in that ebook, it used page numbers for an ebook.
    >>
    >> (In my projects, I used <xsl:param name="index.prefer.titleabbrev" select="1"></xsl:param> and <xsl:param name="index.links.to.section" select="0"></xsl:param> )
    >> (I could provide an ebook example if you need)
    >>
    >> BTW, never got around to saying it, but Bob I enjoyed Power Shift ebook
    >>
    >> Robert Nagle
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> From: Richard Hamilton <hamilton@xmlpress.net>
    >> To: Lars Vogel <lars.vogel@gmail.com>
    >> Cc: Jason Zech <zech@loyolapress.com>, DocBook Apps <docbook-apps@lists.oasis-open.org>
    >> Bcc:
    >> Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 18:42:50 -0700
    >> Subject: Re: [docbook-apps] Converting Docbook epub to Kindle shows warnings
    >> Hi Lars,
    >>
    >> I know this is from a long time ago, but I just ran into the same problem with a file that nests variable lists using the list-presentation=“blocks” processing instruction.
    >>
    >> In that case, the XHTML5 (this is with 1.79.2, building an epub3) is valid, but kindlegen doesn’t like the nesting. It closes off the highest level
    and
    elements and flags some
    elements as being invalid.
    >>
    >> The result doesn’t lose any content, but it removes the nesting and flattens everything to one level.
    >>
    >> As with your case, the epub is valid and when displayed, the nesting is fine.
    >>
    >> At this point, I’m convinced that the problem is in kindlegen. I just used the Kindle previewer, which wasn’t available in 2012, and it created a .mobi file that preserves the nesting (at least on the devices I tried in the previewer).
    >>
    >> Anyway, this is probably way to late to help, but I figured I’d add it to the thread in case someone runs into it in the future, since it is still a problem using kindlegen.
    >>
    >> Best regards,
    >> Dick Hamilton
    >> -------
    >> XML Press
    >> XML for Technical Communicators
    >> http://xmlpress.net
    >> hamilton@xmlpress.net
    >>
    >> --
    >> Robert Nagle
    >> 5115 Sandyfields Ln Katy, TX 77494
    >> (Cell) 832-251-7522




  • 4.  Re: [docbook-apps] Converting Docbook epub to Kindle shows warnings

    Posted 03-21-2020 09:53
    +2 on this.

    As I said before, I didn't think this was a problem with Docbook but with
    Kindles and Kindlegens -- everything looked normal even in Kindle
    Previewer! -- But given the dominance of Kindle formats, it may be
    necessary.

    Although Kindle Previewer has improved a lot over the years, you still
    can't rely on it to display what the device or Kindle app will actually
    display.

    Robert Nagle, Personville Press

    On Fri, Mar 20, 2020 at 7:06 PM Richard Hamilton <hamilton@xmlpress.net>
    wrote:

    > Hi Bob and Robert,
    >
    > Things get curiouser and curiouser:-). It looks like kindlegen does pretty
    > much the same conversion as the previewer.
    >
    > When I use the kindle app on my Macbook, the variable lists (i.e., dl
    > lists) do not nest, but when I run the same file on the previewer, of in
    > the app on my iphone, it works fine.
    >
    > So, the problem may be viewer specific. The only difference is that
    > kindlegen complains about this and provides false notes about closing off
    > tags, while the previewer is silent.
    >
    > Bob, can you post or send me your modification of autoidx.xsl? I’d like to
    > try it out, and I’m glad to be a tester. And does this index generate page
    > number
    >
    > Best regards,
    > Dick
    >
    > P.S. I’m going to get Solar Dividends, too. The topic is interesting, and
    > I’d like to see the results of that autoidx.xsl. Thanks for making it
    > available as a free ebook.
    > -------
    > XML Press
    > XML for Technical Communicators
    > http://xmlpress.net
    > hamilton@xmlpress.net
    >
    >
    >
    > > On Mar 20, 2020, at 09:13, Bob Stayton <bobs@sagehill.net> wrote:
    > >
    > > The index in my Power Shift ebook does not use dl, dt, and dd in the
    > epub xhtml. I gave up on them and rewrote autoidx.xsl to output div
    > elements instead, with CSS to supply the indents. In a nutshell:
    > >
    > >
    became

    > >
    > >
    became

    > >
    > >
    became

    > >
    > > That's it. Since the divs are already nested by the indexing templates,
    > it turns out that the only CSS I needed was:
    > >
    > > div.dd {
    > > margin-left: 2em;
    > > }
    > >
    > > I had intended to fold this back into the next release, so thanks for
    > reminding me about this.
    > >
    > > By the way, if you liked Power Shift, you should check out my new book
    > Solar Dividends which describes how to use solar energy to eliminate
    > poverty in the world.
    > > Bob Stayton
    > >
    > > bobs@sagehill.net
    > > On 3/19/2020 9:16 PM, Robert Nagle wrote:
    > >> This is very interesting to me. I have tried for two projects to
    > generate indexes that would work on Kindle. The indexterm content had both
    > a primary and secondary level. Everything would look good in epubs on epub
    > reading systems(and be valid, etc), but in mobipocket it would render
    > inconsistently the elements in the index -- sometimes indenting, sometimes
    > putting them on the same line. It was a mess. Even though it rendered fine
    > in Kindle Previewer on all simulated devices, the dl, dt, dd just scrambled
    > everything on Kindle app for android as well as on e-ink Paperwhites.
    > >>
    > >> I spent a lot of time trying to troubleshoot (and the details were
    > fuzzy), but concluded that the problem lay not with docbook but with
    > kindlegen (or maybe the css support on kindle reading systems). It's
    > frustrating because having a good multilevel index is standard on many
    > nonfiction ebooks.
    > >>
    > >> On the other hand, when looking at Bob's POWER SHIFT ebook (which came
    > out a few years ago), the index rendered fine on Kindle. - although in that
    > ebook, it used page numbers for an ebook.
    > >>
    > >> (In my projects, I used <xsl:param name="index.prefer.titleabbrev"
    > select="1"></xsl:param> and <xsl:param name="index.links.to.section"
    > select="0"></xsl:param> )
    > >> (I could provide an ebook example if you need)
    > >>
    > >> BTW, never got around to saying it, but Bob I enjoyed Power Shift ebook
    > >>
    > >> Robert Nagle
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >> From: Richard Hamilton <hamilton@xmlpress.net>
    > >> To: Lars Vogel <lars.vogel@gmail.com>
    > >> Cc: Jason Zech <zech@loyolapress.com>, DocBook Apps <
    > docbook-apps@lists.oasis-open.org>
    > >> Bcc:
    > >> Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 18:42:50 -0700
    > >> Subject: Re: [docbook-apps] Converting Docbook epub to Kindle shows
    > warnings
    > >> Hi Lars,
    > >>
    > >> I know this is from a long time ago, but I just ran into the same
    > problem with a file that nests variable lists using the
    > list-presentation=“blocks” processing instruction.
    > >>
    > >> In that case, the XHTML5 (this is with 1.79.2, building an epub3) is
    > valid, but kindlegen doesn’t like the nesting. It closes off the highest
    > level
    and
    elements and flags some
    elements as being invalid.
    > >>
    > >> The result doesn’t lose any content, but it removes the nesting and
    > flattens everything to one level.
    > >>
    > >> As with your case, the epub is valid and when displayed, the nesting is
    > fine.
    > >>
    > >> At this point, I’m convinced that the problem is in kindlegen. I just
    > used the Kindle previewer, which wasn’t available in 2012, and it created a
    > .mobi file that preserves the nesting (at least on the devices I tried in
    > the previewer).
    > >>
    > >> Anyway, this is probably way to late to help, but I figured I’d add it
    > to the thread in case someone runs into it in the future, since it is still
    > a problem using kindlegen.
    > >>
    > >> Best regards,
    > >> Dick Hamilton
    > >> -------
    > >> XML Press
    > >> XML for Technical Communicators
    > >> http://xmlpress.net
    > >> hamilton@xmlpress.net
    > >>
    > >> --
    > >> Robert Nagle
    > >> 5115 Sandyfields Ln Katy, TX 77494
    > >> (Cell) 832-251-7522
    >
    >

    --



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