OASIS Open Document Format for Office Applications (OpenDocument) TC

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Greetings! The draft minutes from September 28, 2015 are attached. These will appear on the final agenda for our meeting on 23 November 2015. After approval I will upload these (with any corrections) to the ODF repository. Hope everyone is having a great week! Patrick - -- Patrick Durusau patrick@durusau.net Technical Advisory Board, OASIS (TAB) OpenDocument Format TC (OASIS), Project Editor ISO/IEC 26300 Co-Editor 13250-5 (Topic Maps) Another Word For It (blog): http://tm.durusau.net Homepage: http://www.durusau.net Twitter: patrickDurusau -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJWROTGAAoJEFPGsgi3MgycKKgP/ieuOIPAitqSfTSdkgaWxFoe Nm8r+LhKT5GOeJdmGe7ZoLx+jMbWIolTnsHd3zGEZkfRorHwZy+FCdyGvmkK7KRf 8KUHW0ON9hfzONiS3w5JcMvHs165meKcXppo6lH1336WgEq3Ie7LDXpVjpDITCcU TAQT2d5HMezI6OSdgh0Qt3ih1ZTmUrV/kLhBHx1hq9AZWvLs3o1bxu8YBjv0VGtb eGYXR6S9pweyF82CCKoQwSTbOAfRoDjNv7ZZNgyY+yAXLQgiNENRkLD/oe8VERwl NuRBkneF74nHUlJTQKHDjqUpuQrKmC6GzDbrfNxNol0TolS9cGRTvDct/F2fmdHm XQxqHt8+uYwOoSR/VqWV9MV+PEFFQ4CAlvjW9Pi8P5eMrARWNpQ7ugmGup8jxvU3 GHfX4w/UBijZjggr70Q/QuGKk66kEKTkmBx3Sw1aJccInic86EbIK8qXPK+I6fIo 3HLvMdSRg5ZXl1i1KipT+1JMuStMJWc2RGj88AfdCV4PlSfn5i3PtK6J2lRgGjIh HepTgMpaqvExZa7QRC2kc2COyTwUhReMBQJiJWhBW7Hs+D1iN0MGwYSv8vvKXWo1 Z7ytJ023y3uhrzGsNPDQ19XV9pqAGGhLqzJZNmvEqjvDYqPYn/fEqgjPM92gLysV rxSxYmx1sthlasSYjWdK =F4di -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ODF TC Minutes, 28 September 2015. Start 9:00 AM Agenda: 1. Dial-In, Roll Call, Determination of Quorum and Voting Rights Roll Call: 9:05 Thorsten Behrens +Patrick Durusau +Andreas Guelzow +Regina Henschel Thomas O'Reilly Chris Rae +Michael Stahl +Adras Timar +Jos van den Oever +Oliver-Rainer Wittman 7 out of 8 voting members 87% 87% quorom 2. Motion (simple majority): Approve the Agenda Agenda approved. 3. Motion (simple majority): Approve the Minutes from former (previous) TC calls - 2015-06-22 - https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/download.php/56461/ODF-TC-Minutes-22June2015.txt - 2015-07-06 - https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/download.php/56462/ODF-TC-Minutes-6July2015.txt - 2015-08-03 - working call - pending - 2015-08-17 - https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/download.php/56463/ODF-TC-Minutes-17-August-2015.txt - 2015-08-31 - https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/download.php/56464/ODF-TC-Minutes-31-August-2015.txt Change Jos' name to correction - 2015-09-14 - pending Minutes are approved. 5. Progress on putting the specification documents in svn (I will have some comments about documents I will upload before the meeting) Pending. This Weds. 6. ODF Maintenance Update (ODF 1.0, 1.1, 1.2, Errata etc.) No report. 8. JIRA Issues for discussion: Office-568 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-568 Patrick: Office-568 Close as application level issue. Office-566 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-566 Open issue. Regina Henschel points out that heading numbering and using styles is not clear in 1.2 and should be improved. Office-550 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-550 Jos van den Oever: possible solution to this problem: http://conference.libreoffice.org/2015/the-program/talks/quality-assurance/#Unit%20Verification%20and%20Dimensional%20Analysis%20for%20error%20detection%20in%20LibreOffice%20Calc Patrick: Could be implemented using RDF (Jos) Jos van den Oever: One can also tie unit information to spreadsheet cells with RDF or a separate namespace in ODF 1.2 extended. Jos van den Oever: Yes, potentially useful, but too large for 1.3 Jos van den Oever: Perhaps Andrzej Hunt wants to write a draft spec for it based on his work so far Office-550 be set for ODF-Next [Note, now ODF-Later] Office-535 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-535 Office-534 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-534 Patrick: Propose Office-535 and 534 be closed. Office-535 and 534 will be closed. Office-513 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-513 Jos van den Oever: implementations can have their own custom function which do this Jos van den Oever: agreed that there should be an implementation that does this external calling of a function from a spreadsheet first Propose to close Office-513 in the absence of an implemenation with this function Close Office-513 with the comment on the absence of an implementation with this function Office-499 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-499 Jos van den Oever: duplicate of office-550 Close as duplicate of Office-550 No objections - close as duplicate of Office-550 Office-498 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-498 Jos van den Oever: DISTINCT could be implemented with 6.4.7Infix Operator "=" Propose set OFFICE-498 to ODF-Next Set OFFICE-498 to ODF-Next [Now ODF-Later] Office-497 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-497 Propose ODF-Next Set to ODF-Next [Now ODF-Later] Office-452 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-452 Propose ODF-Next Set to ODF-Next [Now ODF-Later] Office-439 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-439 Set to close. Office-426 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-426 http://docs.oasis-open.org/office/v1.2/os/OpenDocument-v1.2-os-part1.html#element-style_page-layout-properties http://docs.oasis-open.org/office/v1.2/os/OpenDocument-v1.2-os-part1.html#__RefHeading__1420170_253892949 Tom O`Reilly: Would vertical justification take into account other elements on the page? Jos van den Oever: I think it should. It's quite tricky to implement i think. Propose Office-426 for ODF-Next set OFFICE-426 for ODF-Next [Now ODF-Later] 9. Target date for ODF 1.3 and its probable contents? 10. New comments on the comments list since last TC call [none so far] 11. Adjournment Adjourn - 10:35 AM *****chat log***** Please change your name from 'anonymous' using the Settings button anonymous morphed into Patrick Patrick: Proposed Agenda: 1. Dial-In, Roll Call, Determination of Quorum and Voting Rights 2. Motion (simple majority): Approve the Agenda 3. Motion (simple majority): Approve the Minutes from former TC calls - 2015-06-22 - https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/download.php/56461/ODF-TC-Minutes-22June2015.txt - 2015-07-06 - https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/download.php/56462/ODF-TC-Minutes-6July2015.txt - 2015-08-03 - working call - pending - 2015-08-17 - https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/download.php/56463/ODF-TC-Minutes-17-August-2015.txt - 2015-08-31 - https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/download.php/56464/ODF-TC-Minutes-31-August-2015.txt - 2015-09-14 - pending 5. Progress on putting the specification documents in svn (I will have some comments about documents I will upload before the meeting) 6. ODF Maintenance Update (ODF 1.0, 1.1, 1.2, Errata etc.) 8. JIRA Issues for discussion: Office-602 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-602 - Unclear sentence in 2.5 of ODF 1.0 Propose: close Note: fixed in 1.2, possibly an errata for 1.0 but I would not bother. Office-568 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-568 - Change tracking issue Propose: 1.3 Note: Related to change tracking. Wants tracking stored in separate file, external to the package? Punt to change tracking SC. Office-566 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-566 - Concerns and Wants Related to Text Sections in OD v 1.1+ Propose: 1.3 Note: The comment at: https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office-comment/200712/msg00005.html is complex and I haven't worked out what may be missing from our current definitions. Anyone else want to take a crack at it? Office-550 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-550 - Re: [office-comment] Unit system tracking Propose: close Note: Wheeler says there is no experience in spreadsheets with unit system tracking, suggest we not go there. Office-535 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-535 - Unclear sentence in 2.1.1 of ODF 1.0 [N0942#40] Propose: close Note: Fixed in ODF 1.2 Office-534 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-534 - Unclear sentence in 2.1.1 of ODF 1.0 [N0942#41] Propose: close Note: Fixed in 1.2 see Office-2053 Office-513 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-513 - Interface META-functions Propose: close Note: Commenter says every spreadsheet lacks a function to send data to external application and import the results. Should we be the first? Implementers? Office-499 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-499 - Data Type Specification and Conversion like in FORTRESS Propose: close Note: One of the spreadsheet experts needs to comment, don't we already have this in OpenFormula 4 Types? Office-498 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-498 - DISTINCT Values Propose: close Note: Eike points out this is already possible in spreadsheets but not a pre-defined function (this is predefined in Xquery by the way) Office-497 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-498 - Very Weak String Support in ODF Propose: 1.3? Note: Wheeler deferred because of lack of experience with requested functions. Implementers? Office-452 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-452 - RFE: Colour space capability within OpenDocument Propose: 1.3? Note: High end color features, including: 1. ability to specify colours in terms of CMY, CMYK; 2. ability to specify an RGB colour space (e.g., sRGB) for conversion purposes; 3. ability to load images etc. in formats such as CMYK, and retain RGB conversions for future use (that is, for RGB display purposes), since different applications will convert them differently (or be unable to convert them); 4. support for ISO 15076 (ICC Color Profiles) - see, e.g., the work in CSS3: http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-iccprof ; 5. some degree of support for Pantone(?) Interest from implementers? Office-439 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-439 - "page" in 15.3.4 Border Line Width of ODF 1.0 [N0942#89] Propose: close Note: Fixed a long time ago. Office-426 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-439 - RFE: Vertical Justification Propose: 1.3? Note: See 20.388 for one method of achieving this effect with no changes. Biggest problem is that ODF has no defined page geometry. That would be very useful but also a big ask. Doable, particularly if we borrowed the xsl:fo model. Office- 353 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-353 - Alternative Glyphs Propose: 1.3? Note: Is this an issue? There is no generic Unicode font so every font you specify with styles is a choice of glyphs. Regina Henschel comments: ***** I have looked at issue OFFICE-353, https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-353 I suggest to close it as duplicate of issue OFFICE-3414, Public Comment: Proposal for adding Font Feature support to ODF https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-3414 Issue 3414 has a detailed description of the problem in the document which is attached to the public comment. https://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office-comment/201008/pdf00000.pdf https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/email/archives/201509/msg00012.html ***** Office-298 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-298 - Seeks formal content model of ODF Propose: 1.3 Note: Requests a formal data model (UML, etc.) - Would help with the change tracking but also a lot of work. Quite old, 2006. Office-296 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-296 - Would like ODF to allow "semantic markup at smaller granularities than at the document level" Propose: close Note: Updated to be a new feature and one that is satisfied by our current RDF support. Suggest close. Office-286 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-286 - Proposal to allow multiple markups within an ODF document Propose: 1.3? Note: Embedding non-ODF markup/code for processing by non-ODF applications. Interest from implementers? Office-260 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-260 - Broken link on PDF page 2 Propose: close Note: Close as we verify all links for drafts. Office-228 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-228 Font Embedding Regina Henschel suggests: ***** I have looked at issue OFFICE-228 "Public Comment: Font Embedding" https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-228 Font embedding is already possible in ODF 1.2. LibreOffice has implemented it. It uses the element "svg:font-face-uri", child of "svg:font-face-src", child of "style:font-face". The font-file is stored in a folder "Fonts" in the package and as element "office:binary-data" in the flat format. As far as I see, nothing of that violates the standard. There exists issue OFFICE-2600 "folder structure for scripts, media..." https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-2600 I suggest to use that issue, if it is intended to standardize the structure for storing the font-files in the package. My suggestion: Comment in issue OFFICE-228, that font embedding is already possible with ODF1.2 and that the structure will be discussed in OFFICE-2600. Then close the issue with resolution "no action". https://www.oasis-open.org/apps/org/workgroup/office/email/archives/201509/msg00011.html ***** Propose comment and close as suggested by Regina. Office-220 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-220 - Annotating the RelaxNG schema of ODF Propose: close? Note: The proposed annotation returns 404. Unless someone on the TC wants to annotate a separate version of the schema. Changed to new feature. Office-212 https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-212 - Integrate "Intelligence Community Information Security Markings" with ODF? Propose: 1.3? Note: 404 for link in email. Try: http://www.dni.gov/index.php/about/organization/chief-information-officer/information-security-marking-metadata Could this be adapted to our RDF metadata? Worth contacting the government to see if they will contribute work cycles. 9. Target date for ODF 1.3 and its probable contents? 10. New comments on the comments list since last TC call [none so far] 11. Adjournment anonymous morphed into Jos van den Oever Tom O`Reilly: Good Morning Patrick: I'm here but someone is mowing right outside my open office door. Jos van den Oever: hello everyone Patrick: That is just the proposed agenda Jos van den Oever: With all this text already in the chat i feared i was an hour late. Tom O`Reilly: Do you think the mowing will take long? anonymous morphed into Thorsten Behrens Thorsten Behrens: hi guys, Thorsten Behrens: sorry for being late Oliver-Rainer Wittmann: I agree to Patrick's proposal regarding OFFICE-602 Jos van den Oever: seems like my audio died, i agree with keeping 568 open for 1.3 Jos van den Oever: "I propose that the ODF address this issue by requiring that such history data be stored in an external file rather than the original document by default" Patrick: Office-568 - Close, this is an application level issue. Oliver-Rainer Wittmann: +1 Patrick: Close Office-568 as suggested. Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-566 Regina Henschel: The comment about only allowing paragraphs is correct for Odf1.1, but it is solved already in ODF1.2. Regina Henschel: The handling of heading numbering and of using styles is indeed not clear in the specification and has to be improved. Patrick: Modify issue to contain Regina Patrick: Regina's modification for 1.3 Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-550 Jos van den Oever: possible solution to this problem: http://conference.libreoffice.org/2015/the-program/talks/quality-assurance/#Unit%20Verification%20and%20Dimensional%20Analysis%20for%20error%20detection%20in%20LibreOffice%20Calc Patrick: Could be implemented using RDF (Jos) Jos van den Oever: One can also tie unit information to spreadsheet cells with RDF or a separate namespace in ODF 1.2 extended. Jos van den Oever: Yes, potentially useful, but too large for 1.3 Patrick: Propose Office-550 be set for ODF-Next Jos van den Oever: Perhaps Andrzej Hunt wants to write a draft spec for it based on his work so far Patrick: Office-550 will be set for ODF-Next Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-535 Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-534 Patrick: Propose Office-535 and 534 be closed. Jos van den Oever: agreed Oliver-Rainer Wittmann: +1 Patrick: Office-535 and 534 will be closed. Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-513 Jos van den Oever: implementations can have their own custom function which do this Jos van den Oever: agreed that there should be an implementation that does this external calling of a function from a spreadsheet first Patrick: Propose to close Office-513 in the absence of an implemenation with this function Tom O`Reilly: agreed Patrick: Close Office-513 with the comment on the absence of an implementation with this function Tom O`Reilly: the bird chirping sounds nice. Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-499 Jos van den Oever: duplicate of office-550 Patrick: Close as duplicate of Office-550 Patrick: No objections - close as duplicate of Office-550 Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-498 Jos van den Oever: DISTINCT could be implemented with 6.4.7Infix Operator "=" Patrick: Propose set OFFICE-498 to ODF-Next Patrick: Set OFFICE-498 to ODF-Next Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-452 Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-497 Patrick: Propose ODF-Next Patrick: Set to ODF-Next Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-452 Patrick: Propose ODF-Next Patrick: Set to ODF-Next Patrick: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-439 Patrick: Set to close. Jos van den Oever: https://issues.oasis-open.org/browse/OFFICE-426 Jos van den Oever: http://docs.oasis-open.org/office/v1.2/os/OpenDocument-v1.2-os-part1.html#element-style_page-layout-properties Jos van den Oever: http://docs.oasis-open.org/office/v1.2/os/OpenDocument-v1.2-os-part1.html#__RefHeading__1420170_253892949 Tom O`Reilly: Would vertical justification take into account other elements on the page? Jos van den Oever: I think it should. It's quite tricky to implement i think. Patrick: Propose Office-426 for ODF-Next Patrick: set OFFICE-426 for ODF-Next Oliver-Rainer Wittmann: bye Thorsten Behrens: bye guys! Andras Timar: bye