OASIS XML Localisation Interchange File Format (XLIFF) TC

Hi Yves,   The example you gave is not good for considering plural forms. It is actually an example of text with inline tags containing subflows that should be sent to their own units/segments. In this particular case, the separated entries might need some attributes with context information. Plural forms in PO files have separate targets for each count value. This means that we have to deal with one source with many targets. This is a situation not contemplated yet in the schema draft or the elements defined so far.   Regards, Rodolfo -- Rodolfo M. Raya Maxprograms http://www.maxprograms.com    

Hi Rodolfo, > The example you gave is not good for > considering plural forms. Yes, PO plural forms are different, but ChoiceFormat is about plural forms too ( http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/i18n/format/choiceFormat.html ). And, I agree, it is also about sub-flows. The question the SC has is: How would one represent this and does the inline codes need more than the simple subflows attribute to handle it? (or should one even uses sub-flows in this case? Maybe that makes thing just more complicated than they need to be). Cheers, -ys

In the ICU implementation of plurals, ICU docs do not recommend using substrings (subflows) but separate translated elements.  In the ICU version of ChoiceFormat, ChoiceFormat is officially deprecated.   http://userguide.icu-project.org/formatparse/messages#TOC-Complex-Argument-Types   -s Yves Savourel ---01/10/2012 09:29:05 AM---Hi Rodolfo, > The example you gave is not good for From: Yves Savourel <ysavourel@enlaso.com> To: <xliff@lists.oasis-open.org>, Date: 01/10/2012 09:29 AM Subject: RE: [xliff] Plural forms and XLIFF Sent by: <xliff@lists.oasis-open.org> Hi Rodolfo, > The example you gave is not good for > considering plural forms. Yes, PO plural forms are different, but ChoiceFormat is about plural forms too ( http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/i18n/format/choiceFormat.html ). And, I agree, it is also about sub-flows. The question the SC has is: How would one represent this and does the inline codes need more than the simple subflows attribute to handle it? (or should one even uses sub-flows in this case? Maybe that makes thing just more complicated than they need to be). Cheers, -ys --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xliff-unsubscribe@lists.oasis-open.org For additional commands, e-mail: xliff-help@lists.oasis-open.org

Hi Steven,   Check the current draft for XLIFF 2.0 and you will see that we don’t plan to use subflows inside a segment. A mechanism for representing subflows in their own units/segments has been designed.   Some time ago we voted against having an equivalent to the old <sub> element in XLIFF 2.0   Regards, Rodolfo -- Rodolfo M. Raya       rmraya@maxprograms.com Maxprograms       http://www.maxprograms.com   From: xliff@lists.oasis-open.org [mailto:xliff@lists.oasis-open.org] On Behalf Of Steven R Loomis Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 3:49 PM To: Yves Savourel Cc: xliff@lists.oasis-open.org Subject: RE: [xliff] Plural forms and XLIFF   In the ICU implementation of plurals, ICU docs do not recommend using substrings (subflows) but separate translated elements.  In the ICU version of ChoiceFormat, ChoiceFormat is officially deprecated.   http://userguide.icu-project.org/formatparse/messages#TOC-Complex-Argument-Types   -s Yves Savourel ---01/10/2012 09:29:05 AM---Hi Rodolfo, > The example you gave is not good for From: Yves Savourel < ysavourel@enlaso.com > To: < xliff@lists.oasis-open.org >, Date: 01/10/2012 09:29 AM Subject: RE: [xliff] Plural forms and XLIFF Sent by: < xliff@lists.oasis-open.org > Hi Rodolfo, > The example you gave is not good for > considering plural forms. Yes, PO plural forms are different, but ChoiceFormat is about plural forms too ( http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/i18n/format/choiceFormat.html ). And, I agree, it is also about sub-flows. The question the SC has is: How would one represent this and does the inline codes need more than the simple subflows attribute to handle it? (or should one even uses sub-flows in this case? Maybe that makes thing just more complicated than they need to be). Cheers, -ys --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xliff-unsubscribe@lists.oasis-open.org For additional commands, e-mail: xliff-help@lists.oasis-open.org

ChoiceFormat, although designed for this purpose, has been found to be inadequate for plural formats in many languages.  French is not handled easily, much less Russian or Arabic. See the CLDR plural data on different languages here, particularly at the bottom of the page: http://unicode.org/repos/cldr-tmp/trunk/diff/supplemental/language_plural_rules.html   I have an item in the feature list to work on this as well. Steven "Rodolfo M. Raya" ---01/10/2012 09:00:32 AM---Hi Yves,   The example you gave is not good for considering plural forms. It is actually an example From: "Rodolfo M. Raya" <rmraya@maxprograms.com> To: xliff@lists.oasis-open.org, Date: 01/10/2012 09:00 AM Subject: RE: [xliff] Plural forms and XLIFF Sent by: <xliff@lists.oasis-open.org> Hi Yves,   The example you gave is not good for considering plural forms. It is actually an example of text with inline tags containing subflows that should be sent to their own units/segments. In this particular case, the separated entries might need some attributes with context information. Plural forms in PO files have separate targets for each count value. This means that we have to deal with one source with many targets. This is a situation not contemplated yet in the schema draft or the elements defined so far.   Regards, Rodolfo -- Rodolfo M. Raya Maxprograms http://www.maxprograms.com    
Original Message -------- Subject: [xliff] Plural forms and XLIFF From: Yves Savourel < ysavourel@enlaso.com > Date: Tue, January 10, 2012 2:37 pm To: < xliff@lists.oasis-open.org > Hi all, During today's Inline Codes SC call the topic of how to represent plural form came up. For example how we would extract the following java string: "There {0,choice,0#are no files 1#is one file 1" Since this is not only involving the inline code, we decided to bring that topic to the TC level. We have some existing work done on this in the PO representation guide ( http://docs.oasis-open.org/xliff/v1.2/xliff-profile-po/xliff-profile-po-1.2-cd02.html#s.detailed_mapping.tu ) And we have also an item in the wiki: http://wiki.oasis-open.org/xliff/XLIFF2.0/Feature/Plural%20Entries This is not an urgent topic, but it would help the SC if we had some ideas on how this could affect inline codes. Thanks for any input, -yves --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xliff-unsubscribe@lists.oasis-open.org For additional commands, e-mail: xliff-help@lists.oasis-open.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: xliff-unsubscribe@lists.oasis-open.org For additional commands, e-mail: xliff-help@lists.oasis-open.org